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Thread: [high Priority]Game killed after loading base

  1. #26
    QA Lead (Craneballs)
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    Holy moly! That's a lot of cables Thanks for save, we will see what we can do

  2. #27
    Senior Member DaFuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goose View Post
    Holy moly! That's a lot of cables Thanks for save, we will see what we can do
    Yeah, I would suggest bigger batteries .

    Anywho, I just noticed I don;t have to fly up and down all the time, I can just save the game and load it in again.
    This action will make my Hauler jump backwards one floor tile as well.

    So, if you don't feel like flying that much today, just save and load
    Last edited by DaFuzz; 23-03-2018 at 10:06 AM.
    Why on earth would someone spent all his time in life being a little bit creative, when you can go all the way?

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsustek View Post
    The coordinates precision seems to be less problem than we thought before. The main problem is terrain precision at distance and object unloading...
    https://youtu.be/l9SsjKRzsaw

    I wonder when can I start building a suspended railway and not have these troubles:
    http://steamcommunity.com/app/504050...86297697829657

  4. #29
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    This is similar to an issue reported here: https://forum.planet-nomads.com/thre...ading-savegame

    DaFuzz - have you checked to see if the collision model is also out of sync when the ship moves due to leaving the area? (i.e. can you walk through the south part of the ship?)

    Your note about the ship moving north makes me believe it's the same issue.

  5. #30
    Senior Member DaFuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryndl View Post
    This is similar to an issue reported here: https://forum.planet-nomads.com/thre...ading-savegame

    DaFuzz - have you checked to see if the collision model is also out of sync when the ship moves due to leaving the area? (i.e. can you walk through the south part of the ship?)

    Your note about the ship moving north makes me believe it's the same issue.
    Hi Ryndl.

    No, I did not check if I could walk through the south part of the ship.
    I do notice however that the ship remains stationary when landed on solid ground, so it only moves when it's on the base.
    But I would really not be surprised if both these issues are related to each other.
    Why on earth would someone spent all his time in life being a little bit creative, when you can go all the way?

  6. #31
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    Hi guys,

    I've fixed one bug in loading distant vehicles with frozen physics. But that didn't helped in case of a flyer on platform that jumps a little bit on each load. I've looked into it, and it seems like a problem of physics. Two vehicles that probably overlaps few millimeters after loading causes big jump due to their big weight and collision resolution. I've tried to use 64bit precision to store vehicle positions but it didn't helped.

    We are still making builds with the 5.4 version of Unity. I've tried the same save in game built with newer 2017.3 version of Unity, and that bug wasn't there. So it might be some kind of old bug in Unity.

    We have a bad experience with upgrading Unity as builds had worse FPS as you probably remember. But with 2017.3 we are currently testing we see no performance loss, maybe very tiny hardly noticeable improvement. We are currently working on some incompatibility fixes and hope we will be able to use new Unity to make builds soon.

  7. #32
    Senior Member DaFuzz's Avatar
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    Thanks Martin.

    I'll be waiting for the new unity release in anxiety
    Why on earth would someone spent all his time in life being a little bit creative, when you can go all the way?

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsustek View Post
    [...] Two vehicles that probably overlaps few millimeters after loading causes big jump due to their big weight and collision resolution. [...] I've tried the same save in game built with newer 2017.3 version of Unity, and that bug wasn't there. [...]
    So what you say is that the current Unity simulates the physics a little bit when objects are loaded?
    And the newer Unity doesn't?

    I see no movement, just that the the object changes position suddenly.
    The entire fulcrum hangs in one rotating joint as a good quality fulcrum should do
    There are no collisions there.
    https://youtu.be/4aF175HAJKo

    And this is the case when I noticed it first time and is very interesting.
    https://youtu.be/0ztA6mh-fpM
    Why does it move so strongly into a wrong direction?
    When is the center of mass calculated?
    Last edited by Menzagitat; 31-03-2018 at 11:09 AM. Reason: replaced video with a better one

  9. #34
    Senior Member DaFuzz's Avatar
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    Alright, proper testing has been done again and luckily I used my test file for it.
    So conclusion, I give the game hell and the game gives me hell back

    After only 2 saves, my hauler and the hangar door got into a fight.
    The hauler won, and my hangar doors got trashed.

    Kinda spooky, I was glad it was in a contained enviroment.

    please kids, don't try this at home



    Bad thing about this is that my framerate didn't return after the door was shut open.
    Continue with the valid savegame again
    Why on earth would someone spent all his time in life being a little bit creative, when you can go all the way?

  10. #35
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    I am not sure what causes it, I just saw, that during load (covered by loading screen) the vehicle is loaded on its correct place, then it is suddenly bounced meter or two into the air (probably by physics into the direction outside the unnoticable collision) and then it falls down (not to it's original position). I don't know what causes it, but in new Unity it does not happen. I've also tried setting bigger physics precision and better save positions precision but nothing helped.

    I don't know when will new Unity be used, as we still need to fix a couple of mainly graphics issues caused by changes in Unity API (like reversed depth buffer etc.).

    I don't know if Menzagitat's case is the same problem, maybe we could test in Unity 2017 build. Generally when we save/destroy and then load/recreate all objects with its physics bodies, there might be millimeter-precision differences in positions/rotations and speed of objects and the engine is put into whole new situation and it has to resolve it. That might cause this unexpected behavior. Once the solver is unable to solve some situation, shaking appears and FPS drops. Maybe the new Unity has better solver or something.

    Mass, it's center and inertia tensors are recalculated each time you add/remove block to the grid, and also on the vehicle load.

  11. #36
    Senior Member DaFuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsustek View Post
    I am not sure what causes it, I just saw, that during load (covered by loading screen) the vehicle is loaded on its correct place, then it is suddenly bounced meter or two into the air (probably by physics into the direction outside the unnoticable collision) and then it falls down (not to it's original position). I don't know what causes it, but in new Unity it does not happen. I've also tried setting bigger physics precision and better save positions precision but nothing helped.

    I don't know when will new Unity be used, as we still need to fix a couple of mainly graphics issues caused by changes in Unity API (like reversed depth buffer etc.).

    I don't know if Menzagitat's case is the same problem, maybe we could test in Unity 2017 build. Generally when we save/destroy and then load/recreate all objects with its physics bodies, there might be millimeter-precision differences in positions/rotations and speed of objects and the engine is put into whole new situation and it has to resolve it. That might cause this unexpected behavior. Once the solver is unable to solve some situation, shaking appears and FPS drops. Maybe the new Unity has better solver or something.

    Mass, it's center and inertia tensors are recalculated each time you add/remove block to the grid, and also on the vehicle load.
    Hi Martin.

    I must confess that the video I posted earlier, was about 10 seconds after the load.
    What happened was that I loaded the game and watched for a moment what was going to happen.
    When I saw it went ballistic, I paused the game and immediately started recording.

    What I also did, before I started the test, was disable all the buttons on the hauler that might open the hangar doors automatically, so the doors would not open unless I gave the command.
    I did this on purpose, because I wanted to see if the hauler would be kept in the hangar (apparently it does so, with some consequences attached)

    I'm not sure if the problem that Menzagitat has, is the same problem as I have, but they look rather similar.
    the problem can in this case be best described as "huge movable objects won't stand still after loading."

    Please let me know if the new Unity is being deployed, so I can test it again and see if this problem can be chalked off.
    Why on earth would someone spent all his time in life being a little bit creative, when you can go all the way?

  12. #37
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    https://youtu.be/ncUpqOKDF28

    This is a very old bug.
    If I fly to one end of the fulcrum, before I release it into his desired position through my avatar proximity, the avatar can pass through the building.
    This is the "ghost" problem which happens to bases.
    People used to report that their bases and vehicles were sinking into the ground when they returned to the chunk or floating upper and upper after each load.

    Old-gamer reported that his vehicle was catapulted into the space when he was approaching his base and we received the advice not to park vehicles on the platforms, to avoid collisions. Therefore he ended up parking his vehicles suspended into the air with a hover jack.

    Now we could try to see if there is a lower limit or not. The vehicles sinking into the ground were quite small.
    Possibly every block might be shifted a little bit time to time and we do not notice.

    Now people see their bases cracking because they somehow built the base in two grids.
    http://steamcommunity.com/app/504050...9163413203496/
    Why the shifting was not noticed by them sooner? Something was changed regarding the loading process?

    Because physics is being frozen until we approach to less than 100m, we can observe such occurrences much easier.

    But if we get the new Unity and if that fixes the problem then makes no sense to investigate further.

  13. #38
    Senior Member DaFuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menzagitat View Post
    https://youtu.be/ncUpqOKDF28

    This is a very old bug.
    If I fly to one end of the fulcrum, before I release it into his desired position through my avatar proximity, the avatar can pass through the building.
    This is the "ghost" problem which happens to bases.
    People used to report that their bases and vehicles were sinking into the ground when they returned to the chunk or floating upper and upper after each load.

    Old-gamer reported that his vehicle was catapulted into the space when he was approaching his base and we received the advice not to park vehicles on the platforms, to avoid collisions. Therefore he ended up parking his vehicles suspended into the air with a hover jack.

    Now we could try to see if there is a lower limit or not. The vehicles sinking into the ground were quite small.
    Possibly every block might be shifted a little bit time to time and we do not notice.

    Now people see their bases cracking because they somehow built the base in two grids.
    http://steamcommunity.com/app/504050...9163413203496/
    Why the shifting was not noticed by them sooner? Something was changed regarding the loading process?

    Because physics is being frozen until we approach to less than 100m, we can observe such occurrences much easier.

    But if we get the new Unity and if that fixes the problem then makes no sense to investigate further.
    I could not agree more.
    So I will test the hauler in my hangar again when you switch to the new unity and I will let you know how it went
    Why on earth would someone spent all his time in life being a little bit creative, when you can go all the way?

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaFuzz View Post
    I could not agree more.
    So I will test the hauler in my hangar again when you switch to the new unity and I will let you know how it went
    Meanwhile in Unity 5.4

  15. #40
    Senior Member DaFuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menzagitat View Post
    Meanwhile in Unity 5.4
    LOL.
    Guess I'll just wait a little longer then.

    Though Balloon wheels???? maybe you can leave them in for the festivity
    Why on earth would someone spent all his time in life being a little bit creative, when you can go all the way?

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