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Thread: [HIGH PRIORITY] Game ate (2) of my vehicles tonight after huge graphics lags.

  1. #1
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    [HIGH PRIORITY] Game ate (2) of my vehicles tonight after huge graphics lags.

    The original report was made by Old-gamer on Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/app/504050...41765122610256
    Quote Originally Posted by Old-gamer
    "I drove on ~1K into my base only to find that both of my parked vehicles were now gone. I had solar beacons on each vehicle designated "A" and "B" and lots of supplies on each.

    I noticed on the Hud that vehicle "A" was 322K away and we all know where that is... Vehicle "B" said it was 1.5K away, but when I got within 260M of where it was supposed to be, the Hud distance indicator would disappear. I figured that maybe it was underground and I was standing over it."
    The answer of Craneballs at that moment was:

    Quote Originally Posted by Craneballs View Post
    We discussed this in more detail and there's no easy (AKA quick) solution to this). The sequence is already terrain > game objects > active blocks settings > "physical" blocks. The causes for the cars bumping off when placed on the floor is as mentioned - the system cannot tell whether the grid is in the ground (static base) or not (vehicle) and therefore cannot prioritize.

    As far as vehicles sunk in the ground - this is most likely caused by the terrain being a LOD from a far, with details coming in only as the player approaches the location - an undesired feat of huge procedurally generated worlds.

    The situation is not lost, it can be improved, it just requires several people on the team and come together to fix this, and at this point they have work to do with the upcoming milestone. We're considering making quality of life improvements the priority of the next milestone (apart from other plans of course).
    Interesting fact:
    A monorail is advertised as being possible in one of the videos on the Steam store page but is useless due to this bug.
    Last edited by Menzagitat; 03-02-2018 at 10:20 AM. Reason: added the important section mentioned by OG and the "Interesting fact"

  2. #2
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    I updated the description of this bug because it was not clear enough.
    This bug is particularly important because it is not possible to build a long bridge and leave your vehicle on it because when you leave or return to the chunk where these are located, the vehicle falls down to the ground.

    Interesting fact: A monorail is advertised as being possible in one of the videos on the Steam store page but is useless due to this bug.

    Many other similar contraptions are influenced by the bug. Even parking your vehicle in your garage may be dangerous.
    Last edited by Menzagitat; 03-02-2018 at 10:20 AM. Reason: formating

  3. #3
    Kickstarter Alpha Nomad fura's Avatar
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    This made my monorail fall off the rails many times, it even got stuck in the garage roof one when left it on a hover jack. It seems the loading order of player built structures is a bit random. And if the vehicle is loaded before the platform it is standing on, weird things happen. I'm wondering if it is possible to somehow wire in that structures attached do the ground should be loaded first and "loose" things after. This should solve most of the issues like this.
    I made screenshots: http://imgur.com/a/D1FM7 \o/

  4. #4
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    Ok, this is a little bit complicated:

    We cannot keep whole planet surface on the scene (in the memory) at once, as it's big, so we divide it into what we call chunks, and show only those chunks, that are relatively near the player. Also not all terrain has physics colliders, to speed up physics calculations, so only few nearest terrain chunks have colliders. We also cannot keep all your buildings / vehicles in the scene, because if we remove terrain chunk under the vehicle, it would fall into void. So we remove vehicles with terrain chunks and load them back when you return.

    Problem is, that when you build relatively long thing, like hundred meters long bridge, part of it gets out of bounds, and whole structure disappear, while you are standing on it. Or some of your vehicles. Thing can get so complicated, that vehicle on top is not OOB yet, while supporting bridge starts to be, so brige goes out, vehicle drops on the ground, and when you come back, you have vehicle under the bridge or even worse inside it.


    What I think we should do is to change the logic of object unloading, to check object relations and disable all supporting objects at once. Or add logic to disable only gravity on objects that are distant enough not to be supported by (currently unloaded) ground but large enough to be supporting you or your other creations.

    What others in the team think we should do is to disallow building such big things and put like 100m limit on all buildings. I am still preventing them from doing this, but still have no time to fix it anyhow else, sorry for that.

  5. #5
    Kickstarter Alpha Nomad fura's Avatar
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    Ok, this explains a few things. I was wondering why does it happen sometimes but not always. But now I think it was depending on from which direction I came back to base.

    One thought on limiting building size. The monorail I was referring to above, It was stored in a short section of rails, which was not connected to the long ~400 meter part. This short piece was like 8-10 meters long. Also this part was not connected to the garage built around it due to block alignment. (I built the rail first and extended my base around it later.) And even when sitting on the short piece the cart fell off the rail a few times. So I figured I'll put it on a hover jack when I'm not using it. Lifting only just a little above the rails. That worked for a while, but eventually the cart ended up stuck in the roof. The jack is also not connected to the main building, as I can only place it on the ground, not on other blocks.

    The whole thing looks like this:


    You can see the edge of a short interior wall piece on the right edge of the picture. That is where the rail ends. Also it can be seen that where the rails start to bend, they are not connected to the next piece. So it is really not a long structure. But still, this issue happened with this setup.

    Conclusion: Limiting building size most probably wont solve it. But is surely would annoy many player

    I'm not sure if it is possible, but I think you should try to check if there's any other structure "touching" (but not connected to) the structure being loaded/unloaded and apply the same action to that as well. Sounds easy, but guess it would not be easy to implement
    I made screenshots: http://imgur.com/a/D1FM7 \o/

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsustek View Post
    [...]
    What I think we should do is to change the logic of object unloading, to check object relations and disable all supporting objects at once. Or add logic to disable only gravity on objects that are distant enough not to be supported by (currently unloaded) ground but large enough to be supporting you or your other creations.
    [...]
    I guess none of these solutions is good enough.
    One can make a jumping contraption which will have only intermittent contact with the surface below. You will not detect the relationship between objects if the surface received the trigger to unload but the contraption not and it is floating in the air.

    When I think to players who build elevators, towers, landing pads.. the 100m limit seems an easier approach and better than a no fix at all.

    Also a suspended rail can be made from many 90m segments. You have to take care of precision loss due to floating point representations too, in order to fully support this solution.

    Some people asked for a visual hint to see where the chunk edge is... could it help them to park the vehicles on the safe side of the chunk edge? Or to build the surface in a better spot?

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